Building and Retaining High Performing Teams with Kelly Swanberg

[00:00:00] Welcome back to Business, Finance and Soul. So today's podcast is about building high performing teams. Now, if you're a manager or you run a company or you eventually will move into leadership, this is a good episode for you.

[00:00:17] I had an opportunity to sit down with my friend and CEO, Kelly Swanberg of Cake Freight. Him and I did a live LinkedIn event and I just thought there was so much to take away from our conversation.

[00:00:33] I really enjoyed it and I hope that you do too. So without further ado, here is my time sitting down with Kelly as we talk about building high performing teams

[00:00:45] and retaining the same team.

[00:00:52] Hello, I am Shaun Enders, CEO of Transition Staffing Group. I'm having a conversation with my good friend and CEO of Cake Freight, Kelly Swanberg. Kelly, thanks for sitting down today.

[00:01:05] Yeah, thank you, Shaun.

[00:01:06] I want to take this moment as, I guess, just more of a framework of our conversation. We're going to talk about locating and hiring and managing, I would say winning teams, but really high performing teams.

[00:01:26] And I think everyone can relate to the challenges of, A, finding the right talent. But then once you get that talent on board, what do you do to keep them? How do you keep them challenged? And what happens if things go sideways?

[00:01:43] You've hired a lot of individuals, you've built world-class teams. And I think you're someone I wanted to sit down with and have a conversation about this journey.

[00:01:56] And hopefully the audience that's listening can pull away some ideas that either I've experienced or you've experienced in the past and apply that to what they're experiencing today.

[00:02:09] So before we kick things off, tell me a little bit or tell the audience, what is Cake Freight?

[00:02:17] Yeah, thank you, Shaun. It's great to be here. So we're a logistics company and our specialty is managing freight throughout the U.S., predominantly in food and beverage manufacturing, construction.

[00:02:30] And we're based in San Diego with satellite offices throughout.

[00:02:34] Very nice. So fair to say, if I'm purchasing something, freight is such a, the whole logistics behind freight is fascinating to me.

[00:02:47] But fair to say, if I'm purchasing something at a big box retailer or grocer, your company has a hand in the way that moves throughout the U.S.

[00:02:59] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. In some form or capacity.

[00:03:04] Yeah. Anything that you have in your home is moved by some form of transportation.

[00:03:09] And that's where we fit in. You know, if you think about it with those big trucks, you know, with the big trucks you see on the roads, that's what we manage.

[00:03:17] There's multiple faucets of transportation. You have parcel LTL.

[00:03:21] And we're a full truckload freight management company.

[00:03:26] And, you know, that includes containerized shipments as well coming off the ports into the U.S.

[00:03:31] Very cool. Well, I know that given the fact that you've built teams, you're building teams,

[00:03:36] you're always looking to hire and expand and look for ways to enhance who you manage and where you're taking your company today.

[00:03:47] Talk to me a little bit about talent identification.

[00:03:51] First, let's just start with I'm a hiring manager.

[00:03:54] I'm looking to either grow my team or replace some members of my team.

[00:04:01] What are some ways that you go through identifying talent now?

[00:04:04] How do you find people for your company?

[00:04:07] Yeah. Well, two ways.

[00:04:11] LinkedIn, we've built a really good LinkedIn inbound, outbound campaign.

[00:04:16] And then working with a few key recruiters within the industry, you know, in parallel, working those two as, you know,

[00:04:25] within a partnership with the recruiter and then also within LinkedIn.

[00:04:28] It's just it's a fantastic form for us to create inbound activity.

[00:04:33] It takes quite a while for you to get there, for it to start to take place.

[00:04:38] But until you build that pipeline of, you know, what we kind of consider like, you know, people on the bench ready to enter into to to cake.

[00:04:47] But and then that and then that and also with networking.

[00:04:50] I think like right now, networking, LinkedIn and recruiting is the three three areas.

[00:04:56] When it comes to identifying, you know, it starts with the basics, right?

[00:04:58] It's it's it's the it's the the competence, the character, the chemistry are the adaptive in different seasons or different.

[00:05:09] Times within your company and wherever your company is that, you know, I've I've been involved with with the startup and I've been, you know, fast growth.

[00:05:17] And then when we fully scaled out and things are things are established, sometimes that requires a different skill set, different type of individual, you know, startup, fast growth, high growth.

[00:05:28] You know, you need someone with that ambiguity, right?

[00:05:30] You need flexibility. Departments are going to be changing fast.

[00:05:34] You might even have an initiative within a department that you're putting out the strategy.

[00:05:40] Everyone has the buy in. And in 30 days, that program completely changes.

[00:05:43] You know, whether it's a marketing campaign, a sales initiative, operation execution piece.

[00:05:49] So in those two phases, it's really important that you identify, you know, you've got to have builders, right?

[00:05:55] They have to be able to come in and add a new skill on an adaptive level rather than a technical level that you might not have today.

[00:06:04] So that's that's been something that, you know, we have a decision tree.

[00:06:08] So when we start bringing people in, they enter into our ecosystem.

[00:06:12] We're looking at all those qualifications, right?

[00:06:15] We're kind of challenging and testing and pressing on those so we can get to the to the end and understand if if, you know, if they can, if they're accountable in that position.

[00:06:25] And, you know, there's a lot of other things we do as well.

[00:06:27] But that's that's kind of the basic surface.

[00:06:30] What you hit upon there, and I want to I want I want to explore this just a little bit more, because a lot of what you're talking about is intentionality and a strong understanding of what you need to accomplish in a short time frame.

[00:06:48] So that time frame could be 12 months, could be 24 months, but you're you're identifying, hey, what do we need to accomplish now?

[00:06:56] What's our our mission critical items?

[00:06:58] And then as we're pipelining and things are consistently changing, the talent pool is changing.

[00:07:03] And also your initiatives maybe aren't changing directionally, but they are they are moving slightly as the market shifts and as your as your business shifts.

[00:07:15] What you're talking about, though, I think is is very important is having a good sense of strategy of what are we trying to accomplish internally?

[00:07:23] What kind of talent is going to get us there and being very clear with pipelining that type of talent, whether or not it comes through your own activity and your own networking or teaming up with a search firm like ours, like transition staffing group of where you're you're you're you're you're giving clear direction on what needs to be accomplished.

[00:07:41] So it sounds like you're doing a lot of check in with you and your team and how you pipeline your talent.

[00:07:46] Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[00:07:47] Exactly.

[00:07:48] And if and if you're working with a recruiting firm, you really have to establish that we just kind of look through things as a partnership.

[00:07:55] Right. Our clients are partners to us, or at least we want them to be in even our even our people.

[00:08:01] Right. We're all in this partnership in this in this collective to to form this community to move forward.

[00:08:07] Right. And drive these initiatives with our clients.

[00:08:09] Our clients, they have I mean, we have one client that's in the mid market space that have changed their objectives.

[00:08:15] And I mean, three or four times already this year as as they're going through a high growth phase and their in their initiative.

[00:08:23] And they're they're somewhat of a of a of a, you know, I don't want to say a startup, but they're they're a very high market driven beverage company that is is just moving out of velocity.

[00:08:36] That is just incredible. And they've got serious funding and in their initiatives change constantly.

[00:08:43] This didn't work. We're going to pivot here and do this. We're going to.

[00:08:45] So as we're helping them get into and establish a foothold into different distribution networks, we're learning that we have to adapt really fast to sometimes those adaptations that we have to do sometimes can be beyond our scope.

[00:08:58] So we have to continue to develop those those skill sets and those those, you know, that talent and that attribution in order to keep up with some of that.

[00:09:07] And so it really for us is variant on, you know, on your client base as well as, you know, just where you're at organizationally and departmentally.

[00:09:17] But, you know, to answer your question in regards in regards to recruiters, you have to really if in my there's a lot of there's a lot of, you know, just like my industry and your industry, there's there's it could be it could be saturated at times.

[00:09:34] Right. And so you really have to choose the right one and then you have to partner with them.

[00:09:39] You know, you have to stress test a little bit, but you have to you have to set them up for success.

[00:09:42] And and you can't just try to utilize them for whatever sake you want to utilize.

[00:09:48] You have to really partner with them and try to make them successful.

[00:09:51] And they will bring you some incredible, incredible, talented professionals for sure.

[00:09:57] When you look at team building and really as you think either it could be now or it could be past teams that you've had in certain departments where the cohesiveness is just seamless.

[00:10:12] People are clicking, they're firing at all cylinders and you you see that camaraderie.

[00:10:19] This isn't ping pong table and cold beverages on tap.

[00:10:23] This is these these individuals are winners and they like to work around each other.

[00:10:28] And we've created a platform or department that really gels this these these high performers to come together and give them a platform to succeed.

[00:10:38] What strategies do you use to really keep high performing teams working together and thriving together?

[00:10:49] Yeah, it has to first it has to be like, you know, within within your your your department or your company.

[00:10:56] It has to be part of the DNA. Right.

[00:10:58] And I think really just having that clear vision with where the company wants to go, not only like in the next three years, but where do we need to go in the next quarter?

[00:11:05] And having that tied with personal, professional and financial goals, both for the company and the individual.

[00:11:11] And I think that's we're still we're still learning as we go as well.

[00:11:16] Right. It's like you never figure it out. It's never a kind of an end game.

[00:11:20] But I think that's been one of the things that we try to really establish.

[00:11:25] And then also just that organizational structure, everybody where you're at in your company, it really matters how that structure is.

[00:11:34] So if you have somebody that's coming in off of a, you know, a lean or a or a different type of leadership platform and they're coming into a company like I know you and I run EOS.

[00:11:45] And so, you know, maybe someone has a Vistage or maybe somebody has a Fortune 500 company type training.

[00:11:53] You've got to collect all that together and really align it with where you're at.

[00:11:58] So it's really centralized with the vision.

[00:12:00] I think once the vision is clear, you get the buy in, you establish the right seat, the right person driving the right initiatives.

[00:12:09] I don't know if that's the winning formula per se, but we're a very performance driven company.

[00:12:15] Right. So when people win together, I think that's better than any perk you can offer.

[00:12:19] You know, outside of we offer three weeks vacation and we have tons of perks that we offer.

[00:12:25] But at the end of the day, when it comes to Friday afternoon and we're reviewing KPIs and we're huddling as a team, I think it's that accountability piece.

[00:12:34] People want to be accountable. People want to.

[00:12:38] They want to have even kill days where they're hitting multiple base hits and then a couple home runs.

[00:12:43] And and then, you know, Friday comes and we're able to check off those boxes and look at it collectively as a team.

[00:12:49] Yeah, that's great. I know as an executive recruiter and I've been in this space for 25 years, people don't stay at their companies just because of the benefits that brought them in.

[00:13:01] You know, that might be the selling points for attraction.

[00:13:03] You know, we talk about the the environment or we talk about, you know, the medical, dental, maybe, you know, bonuses, things like this that gets people in the door.

[00:13:13] But to retain them, to cultivate a winning team, it does take a lot of intentionality from the top down has to be part of that DNA, as you're saying.

[00:13:26] And I believe in that because I've watched people with amazing benefits leave those to go to organizations that don't have as competitive of benefits, but they do have winning teams that they want to be part of.

[00:13:45] And that dovetails into my next question.

[00:13:49] When you look at really, I've built the team I like, right?

[00:13:55] I've spent the time pipelining.

[00:13:57] I've worked with search firms that that have brought me some key talent.

[00:14:02] I've got them here.

[00:14:04] How do I retain them?

[00:14:06] Because I think that that's a that's a big thing on the search side.

[00:14:09] We'll bring great people to an organization.

[00:14:13] And then a year later, the person's gone, you know, and I wish I could manufacture a person and say, hey, they're going to stay there for four years.

[00:14:24] And then and then then you'll have to update the software.

[00:14:27] But it doesn't work that way.

[00:14:29] You've still got to retain them.

[00:14:31] So whether you get them from LinkedIn, you get them from a search firm, you get them from an internal referral.

[00:14:35] They've got to come in.

[00:14:36] They've got to stay there.

[00:14:37] Do you have specific retention strategies in terms of keeping your team together?

[00:14:42] Or do you just feel like, hey, if we stay focused on our mission and we stay focused on all of the other areas that the retention takes care of itself?

[00:14:51] Well, it is very much a big part of that, what you just said.

[00:14:55] But it's also staying close, you know, staying.

[00:14:57] I think I think it has a lot to do with communication, you know, town halls, communication.

[00:15:04] Understanding, you know, the dynamics and where we are as a company, understanding where they fit in, understanding the position, their their contributions, where we're contributing.

[00:15:13] Right. So training, mentoring, coaching.

[00:15:15] We have a very, you know, mentor, mentee dynamic with our leadership instead of it being, you know, all mentors.

[00:15:23] So, you know, assigning somebody a mentee as well as assigning somebody a mentor.

[00:15:27] It's really important to us.

[00:15:29] And I think it really, you know, we're all people. Right.

[00:15:31] So we have these internal drivers and intrinsic and extrinsic. Right.

[00:15:36] So I think it has a lot to do, like, psychologically, we want to connect.

[00:15:43] We want to know we're on the right bus.

[00:15:44] We want to know we're going in the right direction.

[00:15:46] We want to know we're part of something that's going to win.

[00:15:49] And if and if and if you're in a position where you're not, that's where the communication is really, really has to be strong.

[00:15:55] Right.

[00:15:55] Right. But I think, like, the succession plan is really important.

[00:15:59] If you have a really good succession plan, you have training and development to get to that to get to that next level, whether it's it's, you know, a team leader getting to a director, a director getting to senior director.

[00:16:10] You know, there's that linear path that has to be spelled out. Right.

[00:16:14] It does have to be kind of a straight, narrow pathway in terms of how do I get there?

[00:16:20] How do I grow as a professional and as well personally as I'm developing through this position?

[00:16:27] And I think when that's tied to a key contribution that they can own and they have accountability to drive towards, there's more purpose within that position.

[00:16:37] Yeah, that's great.

[00:16:38] And I want to talk about something that I think smaller teams, if you're a hiring manager, you can suffer in this area because I, as a recruiting professional, might ask you, hey, where's somebody go within this department?

[00:16:55] Where's somebody go within this company or this team?

[00:17:00] And I have heard often, you know, hey, we're a small team.

[00:17:04] There's not a lot of room.

[00:17:06] Well, okay.

[00:17:08] That, that might be true, you know, from one perspective, but I would challenge your assessment.

[00:17:16] If you were a hiring manager and you said that to me, I would say, well, they're, they may not, you know, level up in terms of titles, you know, or maybe those are artificial titles.

[00:17:26] But ultimately they should be learning something new.

[00:17:30] They should be gaining skills within their resume.

[00:17:33] There should be an opportunity for them to level up.

[00:17:37] Otherwise they, they really shouldn't take this job.

[00:17:40] There should be something that allows them that course, but someone has to plan that out.

[00:17:44] And I think that what you, what you're suggesting is no matter the size of your department, it's much easier if you're, you know, Qualcomm or Illumina.

[00:17:53] These things have been structured based on scale.

[00:17:55] So of course you have huge departments.

[00:17:59] The incentives are very clear on where you can go.

[00:18:02] Doesn't mean you will, but where you can go.

[00:18:04] Smaller firms have to be much more intentional with taking a step back and saying, okay, before we onboard this person, what's the journey for them?

[00:18:12] You know, where do they go when they come on board?

[00:18:15] Where do I take them?

[00:18:16] And then how do I create metrics or KPIs or performance indicators that allow me to have those very real conversations with them?

[00:18:25] So we know whether or not they are going to be a high performer or they're not going to meet their targets, but somehow we've got to be able to take them through that journey.

[00:18:33] So it sounds like that's been key for your retention is that you're not only being highly communicative, highly communicative about that, but you're also tangibly walking them through that journey.

[00:18:51] And so I appreciate you sharing that.

[00:18:53] I'm curious, we've all had hiring mistakes.

[00:18:56] You know, there's always been, you know, that one that didn't work out or, you know, those three that didn't work out, whatever the case is for any of us.

[00:19:06] Can you share a little bit about the fact that hiring is not an exact science?

[00:19:11] When is the time that you've actually made a bad hire?

[00:19:15] What happened through that process and what did you learn from it?

[00:19:20] Yeah, that's great.

[00:19:22] I think the one mistake that I've, well, I've made few on the hiring piece, right?

[00:19:29] We, we, I think you really have to look at it, you know, a little bit from more of a, I would say macro standpoint, right?

[00:19:40] So it's, it's like, you're going to have some misses.

[00:19:43] There's no doubt about it.

[00:19:44] It's if you're, I don't like using sport analogies, but if you're, you know, you're not always going to build the exact winning team that you want to win the championship.

[00:19:51] Right.

[00:19:52] So you have to kind of back away from, from having to get it perfect every single time.

[00:19:58] But, but the more times that you don't get it perfect, the more costly it is.

[00:20:02] And, and getting somebody ramped up is extremely costly.

[00:20:05] Right.

[00:20:06] The one, I mean, one of the mistakes that like sticks out to me is I've, I've hired somebody just off their pedigree, almost alone.

[00:20:13] Right.

[00:20:13] I mean, we always do the face-to-face.

[00:20:15] We always do the, the entire process with, with the interview going down the entire decision-making tree.

[00:20:23] But there is, there is one that sticks out to me where just at an extent, like a massive pedigree.

[00:20:29] They worked at really incredible companies within my industry, ran some very significant sizable departments, both in, you know, fortune 500 companies and, you know, mid-market companies.

[00:20:42] So for me, naturally, I thought, okay, this is going to be a great, you know, infusion into our organization.

[00:20:47] Right.

[00:20:48] And this wasn't anytime recently, this was maybe a couple of years ago.

[00:20:51] So, and when we brought them in, the, the individual really just had a hard time operating in our, in our environment.

[00:20:59] And part, partially it was, it was likely, you know, some, some responsibility of my own.

[00:21:04] Not, maybe not identifying if, if they've got that, that high growth capability, if they can truly build, you know, with that, with some ambiguity and that flexibility.

[00:21:15] I just found they were too rigid.

[00:21:17] They kind of froze when the time was to move.

[00:21:20] And, and they just, you know, we just kind of fell short of, of hitting some of the, it was a revenue based position and we fell extremely short of hitting some, some of the numbers that we were to achieve.

[00:21:31] And I think the second mistake was I really invested a lot into mentoring and coaching and working through some of those complexities over maybe too long of a period of time.

[00:21:44] And we always want to give, you know, individuals a clear timeline of a ramp up, but in not all cases, it's, it's, it's, there's some things that are just going to stick out where you got to realize, you know, you got to kind of look at those a little sooner, a little faster.

[00:21:58] So those, I think those are the two critical things or mistakes that I've made in terms of, you know, hiring one specific individual.

[00:22:05] Yeah.

[00:22:05] I think what I take away from that, and I have been guilty.

[00:22:11] We all have been guilty of our own personal bias of wanting it too much of where we say this background is exactly what I need.

[00:22:22] And that clouds our judgment.

[00:22:24] It clouds our ability to engage the critical thinking component of where we say, okay, that got them to this point.

[00:22:35] That's exciting.

[00:22:36] But now I still have a workflow that they must go through in order to be part of my team.

[00:22:42] And then once they do come on board, no matter the pedigree, no matter the background, no matter how impressive we're going to put them through our KPIs.

[00:22:51] We're going to hold them accountable.

[00:22:53] And in turn, we'll be accountable to them in terms of living up to our promises of why this is a great place to work.

[00:23:01] I think when you do that and you don't deviate from a process that's been established, typically you don't find yourself regretting moving so quickly or skipping steps.

[00:23:15] You still have the set of controls that you adhere to and that you use for onboarding and implementing and testing, managing, et cetera.

[00:23:28] So that's right.

[00:23:29] And now there's like, you know, we've fast forward when we're, when we're, when we're like a specifically in operations, if it's a, if it's a really key operations role or if it's a, if it's a key revenue generating activity role, we usually, I mean, not usually, but we always, now we do a project together before they even come in.

[00:23:50] Right. So if it's a revenue based, we look at, okay, market strategy, ICP and, and, and specific influences within the industry.

[00:24:01] And then we put it into, usually it's, it's like a 14 day type project.

[00:24:04] So it's a little bit, it's could be cumbersome for people.

[00:24:07] Right. But it's, it's just, it's just, we're really pressing down to see if they're going to be truly, you know, become an impact player when they come in.

[00:24:14] So that has really helped.

[00:24:16] And then we do it with what we call the cakewalk.

[00:24:18] It's a couple initial interviews, videos.

[00:24:20] Sometimes we meet in person, right?

[00:24:22] We are a remote company based in San Diego, but there's, there's in some of these positions, you know, we do the face to face as well.

[00:24:30] And then they, and then they do a panel interview multiple with the team.

[00:24:33] And I, and I know big organizations, that's, that's kind of a play from the big organizations and how they do it.

[00:24:37] But it's a, it usually now takes 30 to 45 days, in some cases, 60 days to, to really hire that and get that, that right seat with the right person.

[00:24:47] Um, where they're seated absolutely appropriately.

[00:24:50] It's a, it's, it's now a process that I will not skip and fast forward.

[00:24:54] Like I have done in the past.

[00:24:55] It's really nice as you continue to build upon that.

[00:24:59] We watch teams, especially you, you watch a high growth firm need to hire a hundred or 200 people in a year.

[00:25:07] You really, you have to find the compression.

[00:25:10] Just like if you're pushing big data packets, you know, through, uh, through the web, you, you ultimately need to be able to compress that data.

[00:25:22] So it can move fast and efficiently.

[00:25:25] And same thing with the interview and hiring process.

[00:25:29] You've got to get it.

[00:25:30] So it's right.

[00:25:31] And be able to compress that into a space that's appropriate for your team.

[00:25:35] It's appropriate for your size of organization and your mission.

[00:25:37] If you've got a lot of hires, you can't abandon your current job and just spend all day interviewing.

[00:25:43] You've got to find ways to compress what you're doing, but not deviate from what you're doing.

[00:25:49] And everything that I've heard you say, Kelly, the one theme is intentionality, focus, uh, non, uh, a strong belief in not deviating from what the mission critical points are.

[00:26:02] So, well, yeah, I appreciate you taking the time.

[00:26:06] I know this is just for you and me.

[00:26:09] We can spend three, four hours talking to each other about everything, but this is a bite-sized opportunity for us to talk specifically about identifying talent, getting talent on board and retaining them.

[00:26:21] And before we wrap up with everyone, is there anything else that, uh, that you want to throw out there?

[00:26:27] Well, um, I think we're always trying to figure out how, um, how we can better system, you know, systematize our hiring process.

[00:26:35] Right.

[00:26:35] So we have LinkedIn, we have, uh, we have it pretty automated, you know, automated pretty well.

[00:26:40] Um, video, uh, we're doing a lot of pre video where they'll send us a video.

[00:26:46] We'll send them a video.

[00:26:47] We'll go back and forth until we get to the initial interview.

[00:26:49] So there's like, that's, that's really, um, it's been very helpful, right.

[00:26:54] With, with, cause I look at recruiting firms is like buying back your time.

[00:26:57] Right.

[00:26:57] So if I have a very specialized position or if I have a, um, you know, specific roles that I need filled that I don't really have access to.

[00:27:06] Right.

[00:27:06] Because when you're, when you're posting, um, ads, you're, you're, you're kind of doing the fishing, right.

[00:27:10] You're bringing people in by way of whatever, however the ads written by your brand, et cetera.

[00:27:14] But how about, you know, how about outside looking in when, you know, we want to partner with a, with a recruiting firm?

[00:27:22] What would you say are some strategies that, that we can take in order to find the right one?

[00:27:28] Um, you know, no one, it's a good fit and how we can best, you know, utilize that leverage.

[00:27:34] What's exciting is I can speak from your end right now, because there are staffing firms for staffing firms and some people find that really funny.

[00:27:45] And I find, I think I find the irony funny, uh, about that also, but it's allocation of time.

[00:27:53] We're so focused as a firm in really identifying great talent for our clients.

[00:27:58] And so ultimately we'll pipeline some talent, we'll hire some talent internally, but we do want to have a strong partnership with firms who know our culture, who know technically what makes someone succeed, who really understands the org chart a bit in terms of the journey.

[00:28:19] In terms of, uh, both the soft and hard skills in where, when they go to present someone to us, we've worked out a lot of the, the prequels.

[00:28:34] And so the person is excited about our brand before we actually even see their resume.

[00:28:40] And I think that that's, what's a huge selling point in where companies that partner with whatever, uh, the deliverable is, whether or not it's a, uh, a software provider or a search firm.

[00:28:57] You want to make sure that whatever they're delivering is, is, is right for your firm.

[00:29:05] And if you're on the search firm side, I want to make sure that what they're delivering, the person that they're bringing to me is already excited.

[00:29:13] Uh, they have been vetted.

[00:29:17] They probably already have done some backdoor references on this person to know, you know, yeah, their story checks out.

[00:29:23] These are things that other people can't do.

[00:29:27] When I go grab somebody off of a job board, I only can see what they present to me.

[00:29:34] I can't go and talk to their past employers.

[00:29:37] I can't talk to, uh, managers or old coworkers, but search firms can.

[00:29:42] The best ones do it.

[00:29:44] And they do that ahead of time before they start to present these people out into the marketplace.

[00:29:48] Because what they want to know is who we're partnering with.

[00:29:51] We, I always tell my clients, listen, we're not getting rich on one placement, right?

[00:29:56] This isn't, uh, uh, some M&A deal of where we sail off into the sunset.

[00:30:00] This is hopefully the beginning of a long-term relationship.

[00:30:05] And, uh, if it's already a long-term relationship, we want to keep that relationship.

[00:30:09] Well, by doing that, you want to build lasting teams.

[00:30:12] You want to build high-performing teams.

[00:30:14] And the only way to do that is to know who your, your product is for a lack of better term.

[00:30:20] And so good search firms, they're working with managers and leaders like yourself to understand,

[00:30:28] Hey, who's successful?

[00:30:30] Tell me your top performer in your company right now.

[00:30:32] What makes them a top performer?

[00:30:34] You know, they want to understand the DNA of your current top performers.

[00:30:38] And then they want to find out, do you want me to go find more people like that?

[00:30:41] And if they do that, and I, I say, have them work with other people in your company that are part of the, the, the process of success that are actual winners.

[00:30:53] Have them interview them for 10 or 15 minutes and just get a feel for what a real winner in your company looks like.

[00:31:01] And once they do that, they can start to understand the DNA of what makes a winner, a winner at Cake Freight.

[00:31:08] And, uh, there's nothing more exciting for a search firm than to get embedded into the organizational structure.

[00:31:15] And better yet, we get a chance to talk to the candidates about that.

[00:31:18] Hey, I've interviewed their winners over there.

[00:31:19] I know what it takes.

[00:31:21] Um, people like working over there.

[00:31:22] Uh, this isn't just coming from the, from the hiring manager.

[00:31:26] This is coming from their team.

[00:31:27] And that's the passion they start putting out in the marketplace.

[00:31:31] I think a lot of managers and forget that your search firm is an extension of your brand.

[00:31:35] If they're doing a great job, your brand is looking good out there in the, in the hiring front.

[00:31:39] If they do a poor job, they erode all of that trust equity that you've been working hard to build.

[00:31:47] And, um, one search firm, two bad search firms can really do it to you.

[00:31:52] Yeah.

[00:31:52] I love that.

[00:31:53] That's great, Sean.

[00:31:54] That's so good.

[00:31:54] Thank you.

[00:31:56] Yeah.

[00:31:56] Thanks for asking.

[00:31:57] And, uh, you and I will get together another time and I'd love to touch upon some other topics.

[00:32:04] You're very multifaceted, uh, well-rounded executive.

[00:32:08] You've got your hands in a lot of different areas and.

[00:32:11] Well, hopefully we can hit some other audiences down the road, but if you're listening to this,

[00:32:15] I hope you found this helpful.

[00:32:17] Kelly and I, we love serving up the areas that we do have experience in.

[00:32:22] Thanks for your time, everyone.

[00:32:24] Yeah.

[00:32:24] Thank you.

[00:32:25] We'll see it.